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ready we have one more person joining consume okay so welcome everyone we have Kat and Dean here we have Howard Charlie Tony and Hamer and the guys who are on zoom with us is on David George Jane and Sim and if anyone join us later there will be the more the merrier if not here we are so we usually start as you all might remember from a little introduction to non-duality which is really just a reminder of that which is already clear and obvious and that's the so-called truth of our own being that is known innately intuitively that is undeniable is here is the present and it's eternal it's never not here anytime and every time you look there you are there is a presence there is awareness of existence there is a clarity that you are and without that presence or that consciousness nothing else is so this one is for and right mmm foremost and prime and the most basic the most at the same time the most miraculous and the luminous no thing in the world because it isn't really a thing it isn't a state it isn't anything that could be in any way grasped or described the way of describing it is through negatives what it is not so it is not the shape and the size of the body it is not the thinking why because the body is constantly changing and there is some knowingness or awareness witnessing that changes registering the changes the posture and the and the and the age and whatever the parameters uh even the length of hair and all that stuff um is constantly changing also thoughts thoughts feelings emotions they're flowing like clouds through the sky of awareness so there is something more primal more primary than the changing phenomena the the screen um that is invisible it's like a the the nice analogy to it is and i like to maybe abuse that analogy a little bit like you see in a big supermarkets the glass wall or a glass door uh or even a even the surface of a mirror that you can't see you can't see through like glass is translucent so it's invisible so something shows up on the glass a sticker is placed on the glass or a sign is placed on the glass watch out and because of that sign appearing on that glass the glass is known in the same way whatever shows up in that omnipresence is pointing to the omnipresence it couldn't have existed if not for that cognizing capacity or that registering capacity or that emptiness with the capacity to know so it doesn't really matter what appears it doesn't really matter how your body look how your mind functions what the content of your dream whether you are leaving the the drama or the comedy or a romance or a horror well of course it does matter for the dream character which is inevitably part of the whole show and through which and as which that pure potentiality experiences itself through that character it can see hear taste touch and smell through that character it cognizes it gives meanings it, wovens the stories it drains so it's not completely not completely denying the so-called reality of the vehicle of the vessel but it is pointing to that which is prior to it and it is about bringing it back and recognizing that which is a prerequisite for any dream to be cast that glass translucent space like screen without which no drama no comedy no horror no romance could ever be displayed so appreciating whatever arises from the perspective of celebrating the miracle of aliveness celebrating the unspeakable luminosity of of that amazing no-thingness which appears as the ten thousand things which appears as everything not only takes the sting away from the content because some of the attention is relaxed acknowledging and celebrating that because of which the content is even possible but also making the content lighter and it it is not to say that when you have a toothache then it is not going to hurt like people have ideas people have projections that there is a state supreme state if i achieve it one day the grand enlightenment if i achieve it i will never feel pain i will never fall sick i will never die i will never get angry i will never get sad those projections are just another dream cast on the screen and they are only possible because you are because i am the abraham was or because i am there is a possibility of fantasizing about future in in which enlightenment, everybody's gonna bow down to me, and everybody's gonna love me and celebrate me, and animals will come to me, and the flowers will open up for me, and the trees will be putting their branches down for me, and all the other grandiosity that comes from the imagination of what the enlightened state is, which have one thing in common, it is not this, and that's not true.
Enlightenment is the realization that this is it, that there is nothing else but this as it shows up, as it appears. And this is end of the interpretation and meaning that is given to it by the narrative software that has been installed early on, and it is a navigational aid, which has.. its place and it's just a wonderful navigational aid and and it is also to be celebrated but it's not to be put in a position of the master it is not to be given an authority to call the map a territory mind doesn't know it can't know the language model the narrative function cannot touch grasp or experience the reality it is it isn't it's like a sticker on that glass to be a glass to experience the glass the attention is withdrawn from the mind is withdrawn from whatever is written whatever is signed and the way i was actually presented with that analogy was a little variation from the old scriptures uh was show was the sign on the glass door or a glass wall saying there is a god and now people focus on the sign there is a god i believe but what if the sign would say there is no god so now the associations and what what what bob used to say and warn people about that word the word god and the mental imagery that comes around associated from a religious background for whatever we were brought up to believe the god was so what if the sign on the glass says there is a glass it has less associations it still points out to that surface or to that presence and what if the sign says there is no glass makes no different doesn't so this is to point out whatever the mind comes up with whatever the mind defines or believes makes no difference the one and sole purpose of the existence of any appearance on that glass is to point out the existence of the glass so whether the sign says i'm living in a nightmare i want to die or the sign says oh i'm enlightened life is fantastic it doesn't matter what the mind says it doesn't matter the mind says it doesn't matter what the content is ultimately the purpose of life is already as of now fulfilled to the brain the aliveness is known you are alive you can't deny it I mean you can but this will be just a sign on the glass I deny it but you have to be there to deny it so the the essence of existence the life itself you are not dead you are not unconscious you are not unaware the omnipresence is glimpsing its own existence that's how the pure potentiality that infinite field of presence suddenly ah I am now it comes with the package I am here I mean in this body I'm looking from that that angle and not that one I'm experiencing this skin or this meat or this thoughts or this projections or this memories or this preferences but that's just what's written on the glass the glass it's already here is shining of its own is luminous is radiant the existence is already known that's good news fantastic news it's beautiful that's it isn't it fantastic news it's beautiful that's it so anything on the glass like anything that comes up as a thought an idea as a this is what it is or this is reality or this is who I am or that is who what that is is written on the glass secondary importance of secondary importance and if we look around if we can see and I have a lot of individual calls and the email correspondence of those where I also have a lot of with people who say yes but yes but and then you know I I'm getting old I don't want to die or my health is deteriorating or I'm lonely I need to have a boyfriend or a girlfriend or I need more money I'm losing a job and those things completely steal the show completely overcast the miraculous fact that this happens because I am because there is a consciousness present here and this is not a small thing it looks like yeah well for the mind is taken for granted not a big deal yeah consciousness is there so but really relaxing that this regulated exaggerated dramatized attachment to the content of the story of me to the point in which the whole landscape is acknowledged and then just taking a breath and Wow Wow it's like watching any sort of movie or any sort of entertainment and seeing that wow it really isn't a small thing to be so attending to those things still happens if we look at the animals which are a magnificent example of living persistently in the natural state and we have a couple of more people oh yeah we have animal living in a in a natural state they're basking in the sunlight and and we have couple of more people joined us um on zoom and welcome john and anand and and david and everyone yes so if anyone is at any point inclined to direct that investigation one way or another ask the question interrupt elaborate anyone and everyone is welcome that's the that's the basic Weiwei Huang predikament of those gatherings we are exploring that which is already clear we can't teach anyone anything because you probably have much more wisdom and knowledge about ten thousand things that i would ever want to have and that which it is pointing to can't be taught and doesn't have to be thought because it's already clear it's just not recognized is just clouded by the overlay of that drama cast on that screen so relaxing the attention from the content and resting it in pure presence it's not exactly any sort of a mindfulness or groundedness groundedness practice is not about that life is living life is moving just like the animal is moving and so are we we are no different the bodies are being moved when the body feels the urge to drink the water it is being moved sometimes it comes with the translation to a thought sometimes it just happens spontaneously depends how much charge it is there in the narrative in the commentary but generally just like the animal will go or bird will build the nest and fight that find the net the mate and look after the young and the old and the old and the old and the old and the old and the young and and keep the fur clean the same way we humans are also being moved and this self-organizing universe also moved humans to develop the language moved humans together in the tribes and societies and nations and that is same self-organizing principle or same power or same omnipotence which moves the galaxies and stars and and cells in the body this cat is relentless in harassing people who don't like cats sorry heyman and and he is moved to do that he's just somehow attracted to a whatever yeah well i love him and he's moved to come to me too this is really a mystery yeah i learned that he's going to come to me that's why he's so yeah he's the shape that the omnipresence has taken to experience the miracle of its own existence and so is this and this and this and everything else it's just and and marveling at that shape and the wonder of the human mind at work creating a new self-corrector and a new mind of his own self-composed and that's why he's going to go to the universe and he's going to go on the earth Creating the stories, making meaning, to navigate smoothly.
And a smooth navigation is not always smooth as we know, because in the appearance, in the duality, to know the day, we have to know the night. To know the sadness, we have to know joy. To know the pleasure, we have to know pain. Somehow for anything to be experienced, it can be experienced and it can only be experienced in contrast to its opposite. And we have more people joining us on Zoom. Welcome Belinda. And if there is anyone on Zoom who hasn't been with us before, welcome. And if some of the names are the names that we did know before, welcome nonetheless. Is the one essence appearing?
Like seeing, experiencing, experiencing as everything. And what's the same and what's one is the aliveness, is the consciousness, is that which is not even a thing, but it can't differ. It can't differ between the cat and Dean and tree, because it has no qualities. The only thing that makes any difference between sense of being appearing anywhere, a being of the immaterial. It's not that it's there. object or being of a pillow or being of a person being of the whole nation or the whole galaxy it could only be differentiated if it had qualities but it doesn't it's not that my being is warmer than yours or is wider or brighter or darker no being has absolutely no qualities so it is just one being appearing in many shapes and forms and patterns and of course other people might have other definitions of being and then of course based in other definitions there will be other descriptions but here when we just again go back to the base pointing at that base on that basic to that basic screen to that basic awareness in which all differences and all differentiations appear as an overlay because i am i can argue with you because i am i can make the differences i can imagine the future i can brooding the past i can hope for something else i can most of all imagine that there is a person not that i'm the doer of it this is again all happening on autopilot just like this cut is moved by whatever the energy is persistent in the room it is moved it's attracted and it's repelled just like a newborn baby is attracted and is repelled it may be attracted to certain sounds or certain frequency of lights or smell and repelled that attraction and repulsion is that primary movement and it happens in 10 000 ways and if you see that automatic automatically functioning meaning making machinery called mind the bio computer called mind and you see that primary movement the words pleasure away from pain the responding to a stimuli in the way that would be the most conducive for survival safety and pleasure and the moving away from that which is threatening that very very basic mechanism which even moves the fronts in the nature the waves always towards the balance and safety and self-preservation watching that mind doing it in 10,000 ways is the free entertainment forever it's absolutely mind-blowing it's amazing and also without taking any credit for actions seeing where the attention is being drawn where it is moving maybe moving towards learning medicine moving towards learning hypnosis or towards romance or towards making money none of that is in any way any of doing of the imagined self is just that natural tendency attraction and repulsion some people are attracted to learning particular dance of laying that flying the jet the jet the jet or reading books how did they choose it how did they decide it are they responsible is the natural movement just again like the weather and seeing it as naturally spontaneously occurring movement of attention again brings flow to life opens up the curiosity what is my next thought gonna be what is my next movement of attention gonna be where are the eyes gonna land what are the ears gonna pick up this is an incredible vessel for the consciousness to see its own reflection what is it drawn to what is it repelled from what's threatening it and without even labeling the responses what are they mm-hmm and watching the next words that are written on the mirror yes yes mirror is a fantastic metaphor also that the glass is is good in a way because it's translucent you can't see same as space it's a beautiful metaphor also because you know consciousness is like space it's invisible and yet it's undeniable those space you can somehow you know like conceptualize all those words sooner or later will get us you know like conceptualize all those words sooner or later will get us a and will be useless like the word God was used for for centuries and now it's pretty useless because it's so loaded with associations so some would say you know God is love or love is God love it's a beautiful beautiful word and it's a beautiful sort of like it signifies the energy of unconditional acceptance of everything that arises including pain including anger including wonderful things and but then you, too, you feel it's like it's all schedules and stuff you know like it's like ahope that's possible on that level so it's able to play if you so don't shaping all this in degrees in the next few days or hours it's meetings about eight or nine years ago when I pointed out to the quoting actually quoting his target at a pointing out to the nature of any expression of energy being a love of being the woman nearly pull my hair out of my head this is wrong and you can see the attachment to pain and suffering there is no love no it's just fear it's just longing for love that's a complete you know all of the word either way yes the word is equally charged that's why less charge words Bob would offer to point to it energy just the energy just the flow of energy energy in its potential state neither exists nor it doesn't it's pretty good word he would add the description that was a description of the word energy energy I would offer to point to it energy I that Krishnamurti offered intelligence because there is a brilliance there is an intelligence to that energy it flows and organizes itself another loaded word okay elaborate intelligence there's a whole range of intelligence least intelligent the greatest intelligence and all the associations with that mm-hmm that's what I mean by loaded word yeah I guess every word can be loaded in my opinion like depending on the upbringing and the conditioning and the circumstances that particular word will hit someone and load a perceptual interpretation of that yes yes but like for the for the general purposes I thought Bob picked words that were sort of as inert as possible you can sort of see that with Bob you get a sense of that you get a sense of that because that's sort of white but he carried yeah mmm that like bringing it back to the simplicity of like the word is not the thing yeah you know like that's really elemental like no word the word fire can't burn can't warm can't hate can't do anything because it's just a word another word written on the mirror is no syntax and pure existence it's it's that same yeah and and yet you know there is a natural attraction whatever how can one apply nachos to rational attraction and there is a natural joy in trying to put into words that which is so beyond language so beyond mind because what the words are doing you know they are finger pointing at the moon so we don't hang on to that finger we look to the moon and of course this again metaphor beautiful metaphor that has its limitation moon is out there far away while this is right here it can't be closer is nothing closer that this sense of existence sense of presence undeniable fact that i'm not dead i'm not unconscious i am here what i am what does it mean how long where did i come from where am i going what's my goal purpose meaning that stuff is added but because i am those stories can can go and this is not a moon far away it's closer than your breath and you can say it is i am the sense i am but those two words i am already too far away i am is just a another limited pointer pure existence being or like hindu says sat chitananda being consciousness bliss of being knowing that i am and having a preference for being the survival instinct the preference don't want to die it's like appreciation and the less of the destruction by the maya or the namarupa the name and form involvement in the content of the drama preference no i want more pleasure i want less pain the less of that destruction the more the love of being shines forth to the point then you know the energy does not get dispersed into those distractions the seriousness of distractions goes down you want to say something howard just passed the month uh saying something about it yeah it's quite difficult to actually put into words of course but uh i was loving your description of of the love really um it's pretty undeniable um even if you deny it it's like like i wasn't denying it no yeah they're all words are loaded yeah yeah i get that like love and yeah because but you know people do all sorts of things in the name of love so that's yeah but it's as cat was saying it's pretty amazing just being alive like to how simple that is to to like you everyone's trying to get to that or and yet it already is here like immediately um and the there is a resonance with that energy and when you're speaking it or anyone where speaking it it it it moves the energy you know yeah yeah so um and it moved me to come here and you know it's something that we can't describe or put into words or really even understand you know intellectually mentally or so and and that intelligence is the same thing you know it it's wow yeah it's very for a human to try and a little human pin spec in the universe to to comprehend the end comprehend or yeah amazing really it's like every every word on that on that mirror like every possible description every every sentence is structured like you know is representing is me and time and and and continuity in a story and all these words or like these words maybe describing non-duality or describing the essence of reality or you know uh you know i'm not sure um yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah..
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah , yeah, no, it's true. That's a good way to go! or whatever, however profound or brilliant these words are. Like I think the, you know, fundamentally all words collapse into that. And they have absolutely no real substance whatsoever. And all there is left, what's left like is just pure, pure. Even like I am, the thought I am is not I am. It's just not. I am-ness is beyond the thought. It's like, it's that sense of presence is beyond description of presence. And yet it's inclusive of every description in another sense. There's no description that can be excluded, but it's not a description.
It's that which allows descriptions. You can't drink water, the word water. Hmm. It's the same thing with science. There's a quote on the beginning of a Korean drama, unsourced, but I don't know where it comes from. It said, there's only two things that are endless. One is the, the universe and the other is human stupidity. Yeah. Yeah. That's brilliant. And I have actually, we have 10 people with us on Zoom and there is few people with us who are on Facebook. No one's commenting on Facebook, but if you guys want to consider hopping in and getting, getting that link from www.sailabub.com slash meetings with us here, that will be lovely to actually hear you.
But that's just an invitation. It's like, you know, you, I'm happy for whatever, just happy. That's the natural state. And again, getting back to even that attraction towards exploring that nature of aliveness, the nature of consciousness, which is totally beyond grasp and yet bringing the attention back from the distractions into that radiant, miraculousness and the joy that comes with it. Um, Kat. Uh, Hi Anne. Would you like to say something? Would you like to add something, ask question? I just, I suppose I just wanted to elaborate on the point that was just made before about, about the, the, the tangibility of the experience of, you know, what happens when you begin pointing and then this sort of soft joy emerges and it happens on Zoom, you know, like it's pretty mysterious and marvelous, isn't it?
Yes, yes, thank you. It's like coming home. It's like, you know, life distracts us in so many ways. Things need attending. The attention goes on the focus, laser focus mode. No problem. Yeah, it's perfectly self organizing. But when the attention is free, it can literally just disperse, just like the vision, you know, when you read the book and you follow the words with just laser focus. But when there is a possibility. Of just opening the peripheral sort of a vision and embracing the whole field of the gaze, there is something really relaxing in the call up session of that contracted mode and just just oneness with space is something really sweet and satisfying.
And also I had an experience. I've heard it a couple of times. I don't usually listen to conversations when Bob had private conversations. That would be my time to go for a brisk walk or something. But occasionally I would hear the word as I was putting the shoes on. And I can tell you people who had brilliant clarity 20 years ago and never read another book and never questioned and looked into the nature of the mind because, oh, I've got it so I can get on with my life. Well. And suddenly this mind came back with all those strong definitions and descriptions of the map.
That the map was mixed up to be a territory again. So somehow not only there is a beautiful rewarding quality of hanging up in that. I think George pointed it out once, you know, the sub sangha, you know, the sangha, the company of people who are attracted to the world. They are the kind that are attracted to the same. I'm distracted, not meditation, the non distracted sort of joy or luminosity of being and just amplifying, bringing that energy back home. That is something not only really naturally enjoyable about it, but it also grounds. Put the mind in the right perspective. Keeps it in the position.
in the position of a servant rather than a master. And it has nothing to do with seeking. See, I had also quite a few conversations with people who join us on Zoom. We have two more Zoom meetings in the evenings where Europeans can join and one more Zoom that is happening tomorrow. Julia is hosting it for people from States. People ask, okay, I shouldn't be coming here because I've got it. So it feels like I'm still seeking. Ooh, that's a concept. That's an interesting concept. So you think you have a choice to show up and to do something and to go somewhere, but perhaps you call it appropriately.
You got it. Yeah, that's the seeking. The concept that there is a me who should or should not show up in certain place, read or not to read certain book or behave in a particular way is the mind in a position of a master. It's not the advisor that says, hey, look, this is what's happening. Oh, I'm here. Wow, that's interesting. Oh, I'm opening a book. Wow, that's fantastic. That's amazing. Wow. Oh, that's just neutral, completely neutral. That's just what's happening. Neither good nor bad. Really. It's just discovering the happening us is happening without necessarily assigning myself a doership role and doing it. I shouldn't.
Because that's the delusion. That's the delusion of grandeur. I am my mind and I am in power. I can make my decisions and choices not entirely untruth if you consider yourself to be the life force. And your choice is that whatever you're looking, that's the way the shape, the size, the form the universe is bringing. If you believe in a conspiracy, well, that's your choice conspiracies. But this is usually mixed up with the delusion of grandeur because people consider myself, this is me, a person, a little miniature. Yeah. That is believing to have the decision making power or choice. I'm sitting at the cinema watching a movie, but I don't need to be here.
I'm so non dual. I don't actually have to be here at all, but I'm watching it. Watching it's happening. I mean, it's all a joke. The narrative around it and the story around it. And it's just absolute conceptual. Everything that's been really discussed is everything that we're talking about. Even though it's discussed in concepts, it's non conceptual. It's completely and totally non conceptual. This presence is non conceptual. Yet it can only be discussed through the concepts themselves. And Jyoti's got a comment. Jyoti says, enjoying the spiel. And the discussion. Human desires are endless, too. Yeah. And even exploring human desires. Thank you, Jyoti. It's a lovely avenue to just again discover how the bio computer, how that narrative program works, and also to bring back the humbling realization that every desire is the love of being appearing as a desire I desire.
Like. And those grandiosity ideas about enlightenment. Oh, I want everyone to worship me. Oh, I want everyone to bow down. I want the animals to come and pay their honors or something like that, ridiculous. Those ideas of what enlightenment is are kind of cute and sweet and funny and ridiculous at the same time, a lot of judgments, right? At the same time, if not for the love of the universe, if not for the love of being, if not for the loving care, they wouldn't even appear. The desire for this body to be safe and to experience pleasure and security and friendships and whatever the desire comes up is always because there is a software already installed inherently assigned to providing any form of that loving care.
Sometimes it may show up as an eruption of a volcano, standing up and swearing and throwing everyone out to defend the idea of power of personal power. If someone was violated, sometimes even the cruelty for the same reason, whatever the desire and whatever the response, whatever the desire and whatever the response, whatever the desire and whatever the response, whatever the response, it is always some modification of that primal energy, the Sat Chit Ananda, being, knowing, loving to be, modified to suit the survival instinct in the environment, which is not always, it's not always that easy, you know, the individuality. There is a day and night and winter and summer and the winter is cold and in the summer may be hot.
Just like you look in nature. And I think there is one more comment here. Nope. There is a common pushback to that kind of, you know, it's like I come across people that are constantly saying, well, how can my love of being be taking me to a place where it continues to traumatize, it continues to be disruptive, it continues to be, you know, detrimental and unsafe and all those kind of things. How is that my love of being? Like everything's, everything's making me unsafe. Everything's making me hate it. Everything's making me, you know, everything's traumatizing. And I keep going, I keep gravitating. I keep being attracted to those, to those kind of things.
Yeah. Just a common pushback. Yeah, beautiful. Yeah, self-sabotage. I've seen people who were going on the brink of being really, really successful and really getting the love of their life and get the job and everything. Going for them. And then the pattern of sabotage comes in and breaks it down to the point of safety. Where I know where my place is. The concept here of no, I don't deserve that. I feel more comfortable in a place where I'm safe. I don't want to fall from the high horse. Watching the mind and seeing how it functions and seeing all those amazing intricacies of the strategies of behaviors, your behaviors.
It's fascinating to look at everyone else and recognize it too, but it's not necessary by any stretch of things. It's enough to just stay present and open and curious and see how your own bio computer, your own processor assign meanings to the things and also see what obscures that, what obscures that sense of existence, the joy of being that is natural. Here. What causes that push back? You know, why am I constantly attracted to something? Why am I picking up? I divorced my husband who beat me and who were drinking and now I'm marrying the same guy and the same guy over and over. What's going on?
What's wrong with me? Yes, those type of stories are also cast on that glass door or on that basic screen. And those stories are also a beautiful way in which that omnipotent. Omnipotent. Or that pure potentiality experiences its own existence, glimpses its own existence and shows itself and dance itself in the role of a victim in a role of someone who is suffering way, way more than anyone else. We can see it again in the world of of nature. You know how much more the animals pushed into extinction or farm animals suffer than any human that we can imagine. Even humans being tortured during the Holocaust.
We have a better faith in the animals we eat. Let's face it. But that's just an example because again, this is the mental image or a story. What obscures it? You will see that will always be a cloud of an idea of what is not right now. Not right now. Right now, there's nothing wrong. Right now. Right now. Heart is beating. The breath is taking. The seeing is happening. The peripheral vision. Also, the hearing is happening. Tasting, touching. Make all of this happening and imagining is also happening. But imagining is always about not now. So all those pushbacks. Why am I marrying the same guy over and over?
Why am I losing a job after job? Why am I being abused or whatever? Not right now. engaging and giving attention giving this precious life force to that which is not happening right now not only trains the machine to stay in a master's position and not to be present with what is happening but also trains it to focus particularly on this i mean it's like almost like you know the attention again you can't differentiate or you can't divide the attention from what it is attending to just like you can't divide the seeing from what is being seen if you remove everything from the visual field there is no seeing so if you remove anything from the field of attention there is no attending attention is the life force so right now there is nothing behind me i look oh my attention is just created that attention private universe that has been experienced attention is animating the life it is the life force and it isn't separate it isn't an energy that is given to some object that exists attending is the like for example until i think about tomorrow it has no existence until i think of yesterday it has no existence in the direct experience it it exists right now as a thought the whole past exists as a thought whole future exists as a thought ten thousand things all the possible scenarios of what can go wrong and how exist as a thought what an incredible and when is that thought exactly where is that thought like it's so immediate it's so close it's so it's actually like the the foundation in which all the experience occurs in and it's so incredibly now like it's beyond now because now now implies past and future you know now is not really a really good it's a loaded word in a in a sense um but but yeah the the immediacy in this now like exactly like the big bang is now it can't be other than now like there's no you can talk about billions of years and and eons and time and space and dimensions and and everything is is now and and i love you know like this this this attention it's like this this amazing like this There's this incredible blank canvas of nothing, absolute empty nothing, not even space, it's sort of nothing.
And in that, like the attention attends and illuminate and brings anything it attends to to life, whether it's object, whether it's space, whether it's distance, whether it's time, whether it's a thought, whatever it is, like the attention illuminates. It's like this paintbrush that's painting the blank canvas and, oh, put a little star there and a moon there and a planet there and a me here and a you there and an idea about a me here. And, wow, the blank canvas and just being attended and painted and sort of orchestrated by attention. And who is, what is moving the attention in that particular manner, in that particular unique way in which it seems to move?
And even the movement. Movement really is, it's actually not even, that's even moved too far away from describing it correctly because it's spontaneous. It's absolutely spontaneous and everything exists in that spontaneous now immediateness. Everything's existing in it. It contains everything and it can't be, it can't get out of it. There's no way out of it. There's nothing that has ever been away or apart or, you know, not. Not included in it because it's all inclusive. That's why it's omnipotent. Like it's, it's, it's, it can't, there's can't be separated. Can't be broken down. Can't be. It's, uh, it's always occurring. Whatever's occurring in that. And you add that.
And it animates, you know, that painting, you know, the moment he put the dots, it comes to life. It's like, that's why they call it God sometimes the creator, the creative power, the energy of creation, wherever that energy of creation in the form of attention shows of flashes, it comes to life. And the more it focuses, we all know from science, which is just another way of expressing it. You know, you focus into the minutest particle, the atom, and as more and more and more, just like this, you know, fractal dancing, the Mandelbrot fractal, the more. More attention, the more details they are showing up as the attention goes, dives there and dive into the intricacies of your relationship with health, with money, you wanna dive into the politics.
Wow. There'll be more and more and more to explore. And that's all the expression of that life essence. So prolific, so amazing. It can only happen because you are, because you're here. Because that attention can move through that aliveness. It can explore, but the moment it forgets and starts taking for granted the fact of the, the miracle of its own presence, and it gets lost in those intricacies, then again, preferences naturally existing the, um, likes, dislikes naturally existing. What happens next? Will assume and solidify the reference point. And when the things are going according to the reference point, preferences, life is good. When the things are going against the, the reference points preferences, life is hell.
And the fact that life is full stop is out of sight. And that's why I'm coming here and exploring the miraculousness of existence without which. No movie can be seen. And remembering that what is actually experienced, that incredible dream, that incredible aliveness, is just a temporary transformation of the life force or that attention showing up as a room. Last night it was showing up as something else. If you were dreaming, it was showing up as something else. Attention was showing up as a classroom or a ballroom or whatever it was. How amazing is that? And it can only exist because you are. Without that essence of presence, no dream is ever possible.
So seeing the dream from the perspective of, ah, this is how the miracle of existence is expressing itself at the moment. And now if the reference point comes with it, yeah, yeah, but I don't like the expression. Aha, this is how it expresses, including the dislike of the expression. That dislike isn't anything wrong. It's just another form of the appearance. Yeah, yeah, but it proves that the me is real. It doesn't prove anything. It doesn't. The fact that my cat has preference to be patted and to be kicked doesn't prove that there is a mini cat there running a show. It's so natural and it's so simple.
And a cat does not have any of such concepts. It just moves. It moves with life. It doesn't imagine past and future because its computer there, as far as we know, doesn't have that capacity. And our biocomputer in this particular machine does. What an incredible capacity. But again, seeing it in its right perspective brings joy rather than the madness and suffering. And this is basically the offering. The joy of being. The joy of being, yeah. Yeah. I can see more people joining on Facebook, but no one's commenting. I wonder if any one of you guys here, George, John, John, Josh, Sim, Jane, David, Belinda, anyone?
Hello? Howard? Yeah? Yeah? And you have a mic? Would you? I was just experiencing, we were talking about trauma. And pain and all that sort of stuff and reactions and being present to the pain. Yeah. And it actually transforms. It can be, I mean, it's like a fine line between pain and pleasure, really. It's like, or suffering. You can suffer your experience or that's more like a mental cause of that. So true. But, yeah, it's so hard to describe. It's impossible to describe, but it's like the desire to change it causes it, the desire to fix it. And you're automatic, that desire to, you know, it's like this automaticity of, it's almost like how things formulate, you know, the resistance.
And it's like, you know, it's like a sort of ironic, you know, the whole urge is to make it better and change it and fix it and make it more and bigger and better. And yet, yeah, you mentioned the science, you know, there was a guy, Laszlo, who was pointing to information, it's called, you know, which it's sort of not just this black and white cause and effect, but it's like, you know, it's a whole thing. It's like, it's all a self-creating reality that's where we are, that that's self-creating, self-perpetuating. Wow. Wow. So it's not like linear, it's not, it's like multidimensional. It's the creation is multidimensional and yet it's all appearance and coming and going.
And I mean, you put, Yeah. I'm talking of trauma, but then right now, you know, so again, that's all, it involves mental conception, even, you know, seemingly permanent set things are actually also just conceptual. So well, that's the nature of the whole thing. So yeah, pretty amazing. I remember working on a book. Yeah. I remember working on some trauma and people, and there's a therapist and, you know, looking for the initial sensitizing event and, and to, you know, and, and there's some merit in, in that kind of work, but isn't it funny that this was the initial sensitizing event, but like you, like you're sort of pointing out the whole creation has actually created that initial sensitizing event and created the conditions before it and created every little thing that's moving after that.
So is there an. How can there be an initial sensitizing event when every event is an initial sensitizing event in one, in another sense, the big bang is an initial sensitizing event. Exactly. It's just another way of sort of explaining and not, not discarding it either, but yeah, it's mind blowing. It really blows the mind apart, like of, of, of trying to find answers or trying to join dots. And. And all that kind of stuff can, can play out as well. You know, Some, somehow there's an awareness of the mind blowing, you know, it's like, yeah, yeah. But where, um, like where can you be aware of that?
Aware what's aware of awareness and it's like, yeah, awareness is aware of awareness. You know, it's like, uh, yeah. I do really love that you pointed out the, I never heard it before, but it's really fresh. In the. Formation. The world is in a state in constant formation, you know, is dreaming, is moving, is flowing that which is real is that which never changes. So this, that is moving, forming and deforming and out is the, is the appearance is the dream is Maya is illusion because it's changing. It's not real. It's fleeting. Where is yesterday? Where is tomorrow? Where? Where is science? When I don't think about it.
And the idea that there is an objective reality out there, that there is a world to which I was born as a little baby and I am changing while the world is solid out there. Wow. What a wonderful governing rule for upping the game of the dream. Now we are dreaming a collective solid reality, collective solid reality in which the earth is round. The earth is flat, depending on the era, in which in the medicine, you know, the Penny ceiling is going to save you or kill you depending on the era. And well, the magnificent story projected the idea that I am this changing vehicle.
And the world out there is solid. And I am limited. I have time. I have expired date. I was born and I will get old and I will die and therefore my survival instinct is now locked into preserving it not wanting to die wanting to heal it wanting to give it as much of goodness and love and pleasure and health and money and recognition whatever I find good hmm Wow it must be real because like I you know their thoughts and and everyone else has the same and everyone else confirms and everyone else like reinforces it so well it has to be true it's solid it's just another another story it's just another appearance it's like is that really true like is that is there any any substance to it like that's what we want to believe learn to believe study to believe it's society's culture yeah yeah it's very believable yes it is brilliant story along with it really.
And like, there's this sort of these forces as well. And like, and, and yet, you know, like the, the Indians say we've lived, you know, there's lifetime after lifetime. You go, you go. And time is actually a, a, a creation as well, a, a concept. And therefore all the lives are here now and, and not here at the same time. And so it's, you know, and that's our whole version, you know, that's a whole version of reality. And yet we, we just say we're this body and this life and this time, and this is it, this is it. And, and we're very self-centered and it revolves around, you know, everything revolves around this, this little one here, sort of thing.
But yeah. That's beautiful. Beautiful. And that even, even that little, you know, like self, self-centeredness, that little concept, that little installation, you know, in which I am the hero of the story. Mm-hmm I am the sunlight of the spirit. I am is God and that I am resides here. Even that has its own sweetness. Totally. Yeah. That's um, there's kind of no other way really than I to experience. That's it. Yes. Self. There have to be a sign on the glass. Yeah. Otherwise the glass is un experienceable. And. And even the idea that, you know, that, um, infinite potentiality wants to experience itself as a form or as actuality or as existence itself, it's just another thought, but it's quite self evidence that it does.
Yeah. I am. That's it. So to say, oh, it does it because it wants it. No, that's a story, but Hey, I'm here. How amazing a life is. All life, whatever the concepts appear on the glass, whatever is written on the screen, whatever is cast, whatever the dream appearing is the, is the fulfillment of the original cause or as original purpose of the, of the whole existence. Yeah. That's amazing. You were at the start of this meeting. There was sort of like there was talk of love and intelligence and that it's, it's, it's. It's awesome, you know. And I think you were saying also, you know, we just take it for granted.
But the awesomeness of the universe and of the experience and of the self and of the self-experiencing self and love, loving love, you know, it's like love. Just that in the religions they sort of use, I guess it's like a sacredness about it. To express the appreciation of what is the holiness, the grace. Yeah, yeah. There's a whole language for it there. Yes. You know, it's sort of brought up as kind of atheist sort of political, scientific, doesn't really allow holiness or religious expression. I expect. But it's not about a religion. It's about that thing of something that's much simpler. Yeah. And yet the language is very useful to point to that grace and that beauty and peace.
Yeah, just the value that, you know, like just the exquisiteness of being. Yeah. Yeah. And that's what we're here for. I can't say it any other way, but I can't see anything. You know, that for me, that's what we're here for, you know, and even a little bit of that is enough, you know. So yeah, loving that. Yeah. That's like, that's the basis of like the non-dual meetings, you know, like that. Yeah. But it's, it also, you don't need to come to it through a non-dual meeting either. Yeah. Like it's a very, very important thing. Yeah. Yeah. Everyone's birthright. It's everyone's. You can come through it through a tragedy or through means of nothing not related and where, you know, you could come through it through chemical changes in the brain or caused by the gut or something that was eaten or environmental or whatever, even that is a simplistic way of describing things because the whole universe has created that as well.
But, you know, you could go into an accident and all of a sudden a shift in, in, in the, the way things are seen just through some sort of, you know, trauma or whatever. And everything that was once believed to be true can just evaporate. And all of a sudden it's like, wow, this is it. This is the immediacy of now. And this is the eternalness of now is always there. So it's everyone's birthright. But non-duality is fantastic because it's an opportunity. And some people are drawn to non-dual meetings and that resonation, that vibration that it's a chord and there's a funny vibration. Yeah, that's it.
Yeah, it really is. It's about resonating because, again, like Bob would often start every meeting by reminding people that he's got absolutely nothing to teach, absolutely nothing that anyone needs to learn. It's just recognizing that which is already present, within everyone. Otherwise, they couldn't even attempt to imagine that they have to learn something. Now, Kate, there's a lot of work. Yeah, yeah. That's a good one, Charlie. Absolutely nothing, nothing to teach. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Yeah, elaborate. Dispute it. I love when you do it. Come on. Please. Come on, steal the pot. Please, please, please. More, more. Nothing in terms of nothing ordinary. Nothing in terms of no thing.
Yes. Mm-hmm. That's the differentiation I'm making. Mm-hmm. And I know where you're heading, Charlie. And, yes, you're right. You know, it is almost offensive. When I used to be immersed in psychological suffering, and I would say, I would come to Bob's meetings, and he would say he has nothing to give me. I say, ah, you're living in persistent stay of joy and appreciation, and I'm in suffering and misery. I'm coming here. It's nice to see that. It's been a long time. It's been a while. But I did. When I came to him, and I don't cry in public. When I came to him for my individual, I was so devastated and broken and depressed for so long that I would cry for an hour in front of him.
It's just, it's not something that many, very many people in my whole dream have ever seen. That is, that has been. It hasn't happened in a very, very long time. But, yes, I do actually, and I do appreciate what you point. Yes, to say, and when he was saying, look, I have nothing to teach you. I say, how dare you? You're living in light, in joy. You are old. Your body is falling apart. Your wife died four years ago. You're not experiencing grief. You're not experiencing misery. You're not living in a persistent relieving of your trauma. You're not fearing the future in which you're going to get more sick.
What the heck? What do you mean you have nothing to teach me? I want to be like that, and I'm not. So, hello. Yeah. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. But that nothing. Oh, shoot. I've lost it. I'm trying. I thought. So irritating. That was like a really, you know, when Bob's teaching is profound and as beautiful. Oh, yeah. Sorry. I'll just. Yeah. You know, like something sort of, you know, those words, you know, those words, you know, words on the mirror that we started the whole conversation with Bob's words, Jesus' words, the Buddha's words are still words on the mirror as profoundly and brilliant and as, as magnificent.
And, and eventually, no matter if it's a narrative, no matter if it's a profound insight, no matter if it's the most divine pointer, they are all still words of the mirror. And when that seems to be like recognized as such, then there is no one that can teach anyone anything, you know, like, cause they are just words and it's all appearing in the sense of presence. And that's, that's right. That's if you want to get something like Kat did, well, right in that situation, she wanted something. He said, I've got nothing to teach you, but what did he mean by nothing? I just described it now, because you want something, you don't, it's not in the e de fixe.
You want something tangible. And Bob said, I have nothing to teach. That's exactly what he's teaching. That's my point. Yeah. People want practice. What do I do? How do I get there? Give me a prescription. What do I do? Well, that's a loaded question, Kat. Yeah. Well, it's at least a thousand hours of meditation. I mean, totally yeah. Totally. Kiss my lot of speech, eat only particular food, depending on the fashion that the guru is. Yeah. It's actually very rare that I've seen a non dual person that hasn't done stacks of sardinia. But anyway, that's another thing. I digress. Mm. Yeah. so so the it is a loaded words there is nothing that anyone can give to anyone apart from that frequency through which you tune to which you tune like a you know tuning fork or tibetan ball one oh oh yeah right yeah right did i give it to you now you recognize it in yourself you do have to look for yourself and recognize it in yourself there's nothing that can be transferred from one vessel to another and then there are no words that could be insert the program in the mind here giving another or copying itself like a virus to another mind because this is so beyond the mind no content mental content transferred from computer to computer can take it on the computer beyond the mind can no program can help you realize that you are the energy that runs it okay if that's the case then how does it manifest have a look how does it manifest it manifests as this moment right now in which the sound is being produced and is feeling the the space and that there is a capacity of seeing part of the manifesting how it manifests there is a content of the dream that's how it manifests and there might be a moment of what do you mean by the content of the dream this is how it manifests this moment is manifesting as the seeing hearing tasting touching smelling this room these people these thoughts these words these sounds this is how it manifests this is the dream this is it it can be any moment absolutely but it is it is this can i say something please please yeah yeah please anna say something um so um my experience is that in certain environments the awareness settles and joy arises so i i can think of having gone to ephesus which was supposed to be a place where mother mary hung out you could cut the vibration with a knife it was so potent and you know i sit here and again that that it's it it feels very much like it's been it's been concentrated because of the of the pointers and just because of the input so that feels so real and also having having met various gurus having met you know swami muktananda and and mahashi and um the mother they they had such a potent presence and as as does that lounge room of yours there's a real presence there and it's undeniable so i do undeniable to me yes that's how it feels so you know i and it arises internally but it feels so concrete yeah thank you anna there's and undeniably there are sort of you know like situations and frequencies when it is more recognizable absolutely health situations in place and the nervous system is calm you know when you in fight flight riding a car and someone is just about to hit you the circumstances external circumstances are less conducive for for the recognition But then awareness is still there, the presence is still there, is always there.
But the moment of that undistracted, the moment when the distractions are getting out of the way, the moment when there is a possibility to not need to attend to survival, you know, like the cat basking in the sun. At some points the cat has to run for its life, the fox is chasing it. At other point the cat is feeding itself or is starving. At yet another point the cat is fighting with another cat or whatever is happening. And then there is a moment when it is basking in the sun. Though the awareness of existence underlies all those moments, just the conscious recognition and appreciation, that one goes up and down.
And that one is depending on circumstances. Even, you know, when Bob was having a cancer and struggling with a cancer, when he was, he wasn't struggling, the body was doing its best. But when we had an appointment with the oncologist, there was no basking in the sun. There was sunlight of a spirit. There was attending and taking decision of the chemotherapy or radiation or whatever was required. So the amount of appreciation is also a content of the dream. What is beyond the dream is the fact. The energy is there underlying. Whether there is an appreciation, whether there is a defending the body, or whether the body is asleep, or whether the body is in a particular holy point, where the vibration, you know, when, as they say, when Jesus, I think, was saying, when one or more gather in my name, there I am.
The energy multiplies. It really gets loaded. It just builds up on itself. The frequency is almost as if, you know, you have quite a few instruments tuned in together and boom, zing. What is this? Yes. So, yeah, the appreciation, the love of life or the love of being, the bliss of being gets amplified. But even the bliss of being is the content of the dream. When, when the, you know, when the body is asleep, and there is no memory, the bliss of being that comes up and down and medium and less is off. And yet that existence is still underlying. The potentiality is still there.
That's like the real, the real freedom is, is non, is non-dependent on any circumstances whatsoever. That's the real freedom lies in not being in a heightened state or a recognizable potent position. It's, it's the real freedom is where all things occur freely. And there, and there's no longer, how could there be resistance to any of it? Wanting it to be anything other than what it is. And the what is-ness itself is, is the actual, wow, the total, total freedom, complete freedom. When there's, there's, there's not a desire to want anything. Or even if there's a desire, it's appearing in what is. So therefore, what is a desire?
Absolutely nothing. It's, it's what is-ness appearing with a little fragment of a desire or whatever that is. And that, there's absolute, like, there's an incredible freedom to it because there's, there's, there's no one home to, there's nothing there to, to, there's a pure love of accepting the dream as it is, as it is. That's it. Yeah, that's it. I wanted to highlight that one too. But thank you, and this is really nice kind of sort of bringing up one aspect, which is yes, there are situations and there are frequencies and there are locations in which that joy is amplified. And, and what Dean brings, closing the gap, bringing up that the true freedom is when those locations are not sought for.
I remember being, that was, woo, over 20 years ago in a, in a Zen monastery. I was there a couple of times for a couple of months. And, and place was so absolutely magnificent. Beautiful and filled up with the devotion towards the truth, which was the definition of myself. I believed myself to be completely devoted and committed seeker of the truth. Nothing else mattered. So I was, as I was entering the monastery and looking, going through the garden, the fear arose. Shit, you know, my poor husband, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna want to go home. I'm just gonna stay here. And all my responsibilities at the job, I was, I had a high profile work that people depended on and friendships and all that.
Yeah. But even that in this high energy, in that really high sort of frequency of love and devotion and the high really, place one could say, even that was recognized as another mind made, made attraction to pleasure. This is more pleasant. And then the longer I stayed, the more I learned that some of those beautiful, bold ladies were actually sold by their families. Because there was too many children and it was just easier to keep them fed. And they didn't really want to be there. And they would wake up in the middle of the night and scream. And some of them in their early twenties or thirties would run away and have the family get find a husband.
They did not want to, they did not see that place the same way I saw it. So again, life moves and there is no doer. And there is no I that now, if I really, if I'm really devoted, I will go and sacrifice my life and stay in the monastery. If that happens, I'm not going to do it. I'm not going to do it. If that happens, there is no I. There is life moving. Just like life moves the cats, like life moves humans. So if seeking for those high frequency places, and I know a few people who actually really love to go to Ramana Ashram or somewhere else because this is so much better.
You know, the Arunachala or other holy place where enough people gathered in their name and agreed that this is really high. Yeah, the freedom is when none of it is required. And this moment as it shows up, as it manifests itself right now, it's not only enough, but it's perfect. It's complete. There's nothing missing. There's nothing lacking. Nothing lacking, even if the body is sick. Even if the body is taking a last breath and knowing nothing of it. That's the freedom. Yes, Charlie. No, I just noticed the reaction of the cat. Oh, you're right. Okay. Yeah, John, we didn't hear you today. Would you drop something into the mix?
We love hearing you always. I've just been busy eating cookies. Oh, really good. I don't know about these. I'm sure they're almond flour cookies. Yeah, no, you guys have said it really well. I think that one thing that I just keep coming back to is how there really is no duality and non duality. And that recognition that the substance of who we are, that never changes. It's just the recognition. And, you know, the mind that we can identify with and think of as a separate self. There's only so long you can go in life before you realize it just doesn't know anything. And hopefully we are able to bump into enough walls to come to see that and not keep repeating that tragic mistake of thinking we have a responsibility that we really don't have.
None of this is chosen. These thoughts that are arising aren't chosen. It's not personal. And we're not responsible as a separate being to attend to it. And that's a real load off, you know, because while I don't know anything as that separate self, everything is already known. Not not in terms of, you know, deep truths or science or whatever facts, but it's known in the sense that we're not alone. We're not alone. But it's known in the sense of of of this knowing presence. There's this intelligent energy that you mentioned. We are simply that knowing. And at any given moment where you sit in silence, you know whatever is coming up is fine.
There's no content that's better or worse. You know? recognizing that while I sit and there's just confusion I don't know I'm doing then that's what's coming up you know it doesn't it doesn't need to be changed you know and as soon as we recognize that that paradigm that that you aren't a separate being that is responsible for this that's simply what's arising it's all doing what it needs to do yeah and and that's that's how it already is that's all I got thanks John thanks everyone here thanks everyone on zoom thanks cat thanks Dean thank you guys on Facebook peace guys see you guys thank you thank you thank you thank you thank you